tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post902515801656499505..comments2023-07-06T15:14:57.204+01:00Comments on JOHN'S BLOG: All the Old GodsJohnhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02487495921222083129noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-79640352474598431912010-09-08T13:15:39.786+01:002010-09-08T13:15:39.786+01:00Thanks, Custard. Well, I shouldn't be reading ...Thanks, Custard. Well, I shouldn't be reading your blog if I didn't gain an awful lot from it myself . . . Keep up the good work!Daniel Hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07823511443088751096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-52020330271268338912010-09-08T11:27:46.923+01:002010-09-08T11:27:46.923+01:00I should say thanks, Daniel, for helping to clarif...I should say thanks, Daniel, for helping to clarify my thinking on this. I often find when discussing something with you that my ideas shift slightly so that I'd express them differently afterwards.<br /><br />And this has probably been one of those occasions. Hence the confusion, I suspect.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02487495921222083129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-52252529296673139712010-09-07T11:59:52.072+01:002010-09-07T11:59:52.072+01:00And I agree with that.
My point is that the recog...And I agree with that.<br /><br />My point is that the recognition that something is God's gift to us necessarily implies a change in attitude to that thing which means that we aren't idolising it.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02487495921222083129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-50344795276601898122010-09-07T11:51:08.181+01:002010-09-07T11:51:08.181+01:00Thanks, Custard. My point in a nutshell is that re...Thanks, Custard. My point in a nutshell is that recognizing that something is part of God's gracious gift to us doesn't imply that we have to like it <b>only because</b> it is part of God's gracious gift.Daniel Hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07823511443088751096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-52134298057600515492010-09-07T11:40:21.453+01:002010-09-07T11:40:21.453+01:00I think that's fine, Daniel - for the very rea...I think that's fine, Daniel - for the very reason you give.<br /><br />But it's a case of recognising that the blessings of marriage are part of God's gracious gift to us.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02487495921222083129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-39623968618391552152010-09-07T11:37:50.417+01:002010-09-07T11:37:50.417+01:00Thanks, Custard. I agree that it would be idolatry...Thanks, Custard. I agree that it would be idolatry to treat one's worldly spouse as the ultimate grounds of one's eternal happiness. But why can we not treat one's worldly spouse as a ground of one's worldly happiness, albeit one sub-ordinate to Jesus? I think that's part of the reason why God has invented marriage.Daniel Hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07823511443088751096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-73064631574467054492010-09-07T11:14:26.208+01:002010-09-07T11:14:26.208+01:00I think wanting to put God number 1 might not be s...I think wanting to put God number 1 might not be strong enough. "No other gods before me" doesn't mean "Me number one" - it's "no other gods before my face" - i.e. monotheism rather than henotheism.<br /><br />What if we broaden the understanding of loving something "for God's sake" to loving something as it rightly is in relation to God?<br /><Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02487495921222083129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-40371375533561195122010-09-07T10:57:11.845+01:002010-09-07T10:57:11.845+01:00Custard, I agree that there is a danger of idolatr...Custard, I agree that there is a danger of idolatry -- but idolatry is, it seems to me, not when one starts loving something other than God for its own sake but rather when one puts the thing above God in one's affections.<br /><br />I think the same goes for friends as for family: if a Christian friend of mine said to me `I am friends with you only for Jesus's sake and not at all for Daniel Hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07823511443088751096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-33306607768670410342010-09-07T10:17:31.539+01:002010-09-07T10:17:31.539+01:00I think I got the bit about Newton from Aitken'...I think I got the bit about Newton from Aitken's biography of him ("Amazing Grace").<br /><br />I'd agree with you on family. Of course, there is still a danger of idolatry (such as if Thomas's convenience / preferences stopped you from going to church regularly).<br /><br />And once again, the parent / child relationship is seen Biblically as being a picture of God's Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02487495921222083129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-34068765294019817752010-09-07T08:17:02.060+01:002010-09-07T08:17:02.060+01:00Thanks, Custard. I hadn't known about Newton, ...Thanks, Custard. I hadn't known about Newton, but http://missionary-mom.blogspot.com/2008/03/john-newtons-wife.html suggests that the idolizing was mutual!<br /><br />I'd say that I can also love my son for his own sake and for God's sake. Indeed, to be honest, if a Christian said to me `I don't love my children at all in or for themselves, of course, but just to glorify God' Daniel Hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07823511443088751096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-77160287331280941672010-09-07T08:00:23.626+01:002010-09-07T08:00:23.626+01:00That's a good question, Daniel.
Was it John N...That's a good question, Daniel.<br /><br />Was it John Newton who used to be paranoid about the fact he was idolising his wife?<br /><br />I think I'd say that spouses are different because of the nature of marriage as promises made before God and modelling God's love for us. But maybe that's a get-out.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02487495921222083129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18654361.post-82160064563707169112010-09-07T07:30:08.650+01:002010-09-07T07:30:08.650+01:00Thanks, Custard, but can I not love my wife both f...Thanks, Custard, but can I not love my wife both for her sake and for God's sake?Daniel Hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07823511443088751096noreply@blogger.com